My Old 335 Says "Custom Made"

These are actually pretty cool. When Gibson started making 335s, they were all drilled with holes for a stop tailpiece. Gibson would provide a guitar to an individual or a dealer with a Bigsby tailpiece when requested.  Since the Bigsby eliminates the need for a stop, they needed to cover up the holes with something.  Their odd choice was to use a plastic engraved plaque that said "Custom Made" which was nailed into the top of the guitar with 2 or 4 small brass brads.  I've seen at least one that was glued to the top.  You might also see pearl, black or metal inserts (little circles) set into the stud holes. I'm pretty sure these were done by owners who either didn't like the plaque or had lost it. I don't believe these are factory original. Gibson eventually made guitars that only had the Bigsby and no stud holes at all-my 1960 345 in the top picture is a good early example. But they continued the "Custom Made" plaque up through 1964 or early 65 when they stopped using stop tailpieces altogether in favor of the trapeze which was cheaper and easier to attach.

Interestingly, There were customers who complained that their guitars didn't say "Custom Made" and they wanted that plaque, so Gibson put them on some Bigsby equipped guitars late in the run that had no stud holes. Seems dumb to me but that's Gibson. Give 'em what they want whether it's good or not (see their incredibly dopey "guitars of the week" like the reverse V).

The One Owner Guitar

Last week, a client of mine brought in his Grandfather's guitar for me to evaluate.  It was a beautiful 1959 Gibson ES 175 that had been played and loved. OK, it isn't a 335 but the point can be made for any vintage guitar. One owner guitars are usually the best cared for and this one was no exception. This was no case queen, it showed plenty of wear and tear. But it was from playing-not from neglect. In general,  a guitar that has been played will sound better than one that hasn't.  Two reasons: one a cause and the other an effect. If a guitar plays well and sounds great, it's owner is likely to keep it and likely to play it. If the guitar you bought just doesn't speak to you, then you are likely to sell it, trade it, put it in the closet or whatever. The second reason is that a guitar that is played regularly will sound better than one that sits. This ES 175 is a very good example. When the guitar came to me, it sounded pretty awful-old strings and years of dust don't help any. I brought it home, restrung it, cleaned it up a bit and played it for the weekend. By Sunday it had "opened up" and started sounding like the great guitar it had always been.  Think of it as being awoken from a rather long sleep (it hadn't been played in many years). I'm sure there are scientific and psychological reasons behind this phenomenon, I just don't know what they are.

However, there are plenty of guitars out there that haven't been played for decades that may be excellent guitars. They just never got the chance to prove it. There are thousands of guitars  that have been sitting under a bed since the mid sixties when 13 year old would be rock stars bugged their parents for an electric guitar. Many lost interest and never touched it again (it's not that easy to become a rock star).  These were not usually high end, valuable pieces but they could be. A 335 cost a few hundred dollars in 1964 and while that was real money back then, it wasn't out of the question for a family to spend that kind of money on a musical instrument for their child. My father bought me a 1964 Fender Duo Sonic and a Fender Princeton amp for $159 at Hermie's Music Store in Schenectady-home of the "just beyond retail" sale. We didn't know that you could get a brand new Stratocaster for a few dollars more at Manny's in New York-just 160 miles away.

But I digress.  My client's father was at my office as well and he was able to give me a detailed history of the guitar...played in church every Sunday...had a repair to the switch...Bigsby put on at the Gibson factory and so on. That's what so great about a one owner guitar-you can usually learn its entire history and that, for a collector, is of great value.  With a guitar that's been through as many as a dozen owners or more in its lifetime, you never quite know what's original and what isn't and it's sometimes hard to tell whether its been well cared for or just refinished or loaded up with repro parts.  But a guitar that's been lovingly played all its life by a single player is usually a keeper.  Just ask the previous owner.

If you're interested in this guitar, it's for sale. It's all original except for changed tuners- (the originals are in the case) and the added Bigsby. The original tailpiece is MIA. You can contact me at cgelber@gtvnyc.com or just post a comment with your contact information.

Best 335 for Not Too Much Money

Well, that depends on what your definition of "not too much money" is but let's assume you have around $4,000-which is about what a Gibson Historic ES 335 will cost you slightly used.  You could buy the Historic-they are great, great guitars and will serve you as well as a vintage one. If you buy into the "old wood" notion, then take a look at the late 60's ES 335s-especially 1967-1969. These years were very well made, excellent sounding guitars-the best  of them will rival any other year but there are some tradeoffs that keep these years (and 65-66 as well) from being as desirable or expensive as the earlier ES models.  First and foremost is the neck shape. Somebody (probably at Fender) got it into their head that a skiniier neck was a "faster" neck. Fingerboards went from 1 11/16" wide to 1 9/16" wide in mid 65 and stayed that way
pretty much through the rest of the 60s. The depth of the neck got very slim as well reaching its thinnest in 67 and creeping back up in 68. I've found at least one 68 with a pretty big neck and a wider board so they are out there.  But most are what we not so endearingly call "pencil necks".  If you can play one of these comfortably, then you can save some big bucks and still have a killer sounding vintage instrument. The pickups changed at some point as well from the red/orange wire on a "PAF" type bobbin to the T-Top variety. Both have the same patent # sticker but the t tops usually are held together by slotted screws rather than philips screws (the gold screws on the bottom of the pickup-not the polepiece screws on the top). There is no way to be 100% certain without taking off the covers. Don't. Buyers like it when the covers still have their original solder. If they've already been opened up and show new solder, then go ahead and take a look. The good news is that both are very good sounding pickups. I've seen non t-tops as late as 1968 and perhaps they go even later than that. I've seen T-tops as early as 67 and have heard of them showing up in late 66. Nothing at Gibson ever happens overnight.  My Blue Trini Lopez is a 67 and has the narrow neck and a pair of killer non T-tops. I can play it but I'm not as comfortable as I am with a 64 or a 59.  You should be able to find one of these for around $4000. There are plenty of them listed WAY higher on Ebay but, if you pay attention, these don't ever sell. Look for a no reserve auction and at least you know you'll be getting the guitar for its true market value.  If you're a player and not a collector, then condition doesn't really count as long as its stable and playable. If you don't mind a neck repair, you can play vintage for real cheap. I've had a few and I've had good luck with them. Just don't expect them to grow in value like a mint example will. More on this later. That's a 67 below-note the trapeze tailpiece.

What's So Great About a 1964?

I wrote a post a few days ago about the 58 ES 335 and, of coursed, I raved about what's so wonderful about it. I mentioned that the best ES 335 I ever played was a 58. And yes, it sounded better than any I had played but it wasn't my all time favorite.  There is nothing like a 64. Except perhaps a late 63 or a very early 65. Gibson doesn't necessarily make changes on New Years, so there is always some overlap between iterations of these guitars. The neck on the 335s and 345s from 1958-1959 were big fat, full necks. Then, from 60 to early 63 they got skinnier every year. The width of the fingerboard stayed the same but the front to back measurement got very small. In late 63, for reasons unclear to me or probably anyone else who wasn't there (at Gibson) at the time, they fattened it back up to nearly the 59 size. Nearly.
Somehow, they got it exactly right from my perspective. A big handful of neck that starts out comfortable and gets slowly but evenly fatter as you go toward the body. I can play a 64 for hours with no fatigue. It's too bad Gibson didn't copy a 64 profile when they issued the Historic ES-335 63 Block neck. That's a very nice guitar with a nice neck but its a little slim for me. The Eric Clapton reissue which was a limited edition that cost over $10,000 when issued and now commands a bit more, had that magical 64 neck carve and that's pretty much the only other way to get that carve.  There are late 63s with it and some very early 65s as well. But in 65, they switched the tailpiece to a trapeze which some say decreases the sustain. I'm not sure I agree but I think a stop tail looks better and is way easier to restring. There were some early 65s with a stop but they are pretty rare. I had an opportunity to buy on enot too long ago for a very reasonable price but I was just too lazy to drive to South Jersey to get it. I regret that decision. They are very hard to find. And what about the pickups and the sound of the 64? The 64 uses the first or second patent sticker variety of humbucker and these can sound every bit as good as the revered PAF.  The bridge switched from metal to nylon saddles at about this time as well but that's an easy swap if you prefer the harder edge of the metal saddles. I kind of like the nylon ones and they don't break strings as easily. It's no wonder Mr Clapton played a 64 for so long. And it's no wonder that his 64 went for over $800,000 at auction. Not so much because it was a 64 but it was his 64. If you have one and you want to sell it, I want to buy it. I love these guitars (have I mentioned that?) Here's one below from www.ES-335.net-my favorite 335 site hosted by my friend, Tom Hollyer.

You can see the telltale holes from a formerly mounted Bigsby. These 2 little holes will save you a lot of money as they can drop the value of a 335 by 25%. And yet, they don't hurt the tone and they aren't noticeable from more than 5 feet away. Note the pointier "ears" as well. The rounded "Mickey Mouse" ears were gone by mid 63. And above it is that great neck profile. You can't tell much by looking but you can see it's got some heft to it.

Dot Neck v Block Neck

Does anybody really care that much about whether their ES 335 has a dot neck or a block neck? There seems to be a certain cachet that places the dot neck above all others as the most desirable 335.  There is a certain elegant simplicity to the dot neck that is very appealing today. It wasn't always so. Dots are probably the cheapest inlay that a guitar maker can obtain. They are usually found at the bottom of the guitar manufacturer's line. Granted, the 335 was the bottom of the new semi hollow line in 1958 but it was not a cheap guitar-not by any means.  And that was part of the problem. It seems that some players complained to Gibson about the 335 being too plain for the price.  Easy solution-just buy the 345 with its split parallelograms or the 355 with its big pearl blocks. But the 345 was a stereo guitar with a Varitone circuit and not everyone wanted that. The 355 had an ebony neck and came standard with a Bigsby (or later the sideways trem or the Maestro) and not everyone wanted that either. So, the 335 was the bottom and a real workingman's guitar. In case you're wondering the other "thinlines" weren't semi hollow-they were hollow, including the ES-330. After a little over 4 years of dot necks, Gibson got the memo and changed the inlays to small blocks.  At the time, it probably didn't send dot neck owners running to the guitar shop (or music store in those days) to trade in their dots for blocks. But it may have made the guitar a bit more appealing and, sure enough sales rose steadily during the block neck era until the boom ended (see the post about the 70's).  The popularity of the dot today-both in vintage and in reissues is, in part due to the uncluttered simplicity of the dot neck 335. The other part of it is the size of the neck which may be the biggest reason certain years are more popular than others. In fact, in the case of the 1965 ES 335, an early 65 can command triple the price of a later one. We'll look at that phenomenon over the weekend. Maybe.

Is My Old ES-335/345/355 Valuable?

Well, it depends on what valuable means to you. If you love to play it and it gives you pleasure, then it doesn't matter what year it is...it's valuable.  On the other hand, if you're thinking of selling it, then other aspects come into play. Here's a couple of quick tips to get you in the ballpark. In order to assess the year, there are a lot-and I mean a lot-of details that will give the year away. Gibson made so many changes-so often-that every year is distinctive in some way. Why not just look up the serial number on the Gibson website. OK, here's the LINK. Now do you see the problem? Gibson reused some numbers as many as four times. In fact, if you want to include the 70's, they used the 800XXX numbers as many as seven times! 66,67,68,69,73,74 and 75. So, that barely gets you started. First off-if you know the guitar is old, then look at the label. If it's orange, the guitar is pre 1970. If its purple and white, its 1970-1981 or so. Then the labels were white. Recently, Gibson has gone back to using orange in their higher end models and white in others. If your 335 is new, then, simply, it isn't worth more than it cost in the first place.  OK, so you have an orange label on an old 335-what now? Does it say "Union Made" on it? If not, it's probably from 1958-1964 or so. All changes happened slowly so there is a range of dates but in general, 64 is the cutoff for non union made labels. Except that they started using them again somewhere around 68, so you need more information. We'll cover that later. If your label is purple and white, the value of your 335/345 is probably no more than $3000. See my post about what sucks about the 70's models below. We'll discuss the 80's another day. So, for example, you have a 335 with an orange label and the serial number list says its either a 65, a 66 or a 68. They all had orange "union made" labels and there is some difference in the value of these years. These are the three years that are most often confused (along with 67). they all had trapeze tailpieces, they all had chrome hardware (mostly) and they shared serial numbers. Yikes.  Here's a quick lesson. Every 335 and 345 has an inlay in the headstock that looks like a crown or a flowerpot. The position of that crown changed in late 1966 through early 67 (again, a transition). If it is placed above the A and B tuners, its either a 65 or a 66. If its below them, its a 67 or later. I'll post some photos so you know what I'm talking about. In later posts, I'll go through how you narrow it down even further.  Something I've noticed-and it's the biggest reason I'm doing this blog-is that everyone who has a 60's 335/345/355 seems to look up the serial number on the list and pick the earliest year it could be. So, the list says 65, 66 or 68-everybody chooses 65. Why? because they're worth more. So, that's why I'm here-so you don't get stuck with a 65 that's really a 68.  You can thank me later.

What's so Cool about the 58s?

Well, other than being the first year the 335 existed, there are a few elements that haven't been seen since.  The early ones have an unbound neck. It wasn't long before Gibson must have decided that neck binding looked a little classier than having the fret ends showing, so shortly after its introduction, the unbound neck 335 went away forever. I, for one, think they look very cool.  58's are unique in a few other ways. No one ever mentions this but a player who came to my home with a friend to pick up a 62 block neck from me brought along a 58. He made a point of showing me that the plywood top only had 2 plies instead of 3. I don't know whether this adds a bit of resonance or not but when I played this particular 58, it just sang. Great neck profile too. Not quite the baseball bat of an early 50s Les Paul but very big and comfortable. It is perhaps the nicest 335 I've ever played. Better than any I've owned anyway. It had a beautiful dark sunburst finish and was well cared for. He said it was $60K at the time but I think these have dropped a good bit since. I saw a nice one last week up in Vancouver for $32K. Owner was a nice guy too. Another interesting element is the body shape. While it has the well known "Mickey Mouse Ears", they seem ever so slightly narrower and pointier than those on the 59-63s. They came in Sunburst and Natural and had the well loved dot markers. No red ones yet. Shipping totals for the 58: 267 Sunburst and 50 Naturals. Here's one from my friend Tom Hollyers ES-335 website HERE . It is an unbound example with just a hint of flame in the top. Holy crap.